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	Comments on: Police suggest cyclists get off the road	</title>
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	<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/</link>
	<description>Regular people riding bicycles</description>
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		<title>
		By: John Riordan		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-148424</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[John Riordan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Sep 2023 20:19:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-148424</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Evans Pass road, Lyttelton to Sumner, is a popular ride for cyclists. I drive a truck over the same route as part of my daily delivery schedule. I like to think that I stay a safe distance from the cyclists until I am able to pass safely. Generally the cyclists are aware of traffic behind them and do their best to make room. Will even pull over to the side of the road and allow then to pass on the way down, as a reward for the effort to cycle to the top and enjoy the trip downhill. Sharing the road only works when both sides work together.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Evans Pass road, Lyttelton to Sumner, is a popular ride for cyclists. I drive a truck over the same route as part of my daily delivery schedule. I like to think that I stay a safe distance from the cyclists until I am able to pass safely. Generally the cyclists are aware of traffic behind them and do their best to make room. Will even pull over to the side of the road and allow then to pass on the way down, as a reward for the effort to cycle to the top and enjoy the trip downhill. Sharing the road only works when both sides work together.</p>
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		<title>
		By: bikingmad		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-7805</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bikingmad]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Mar 2018 09:28:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-7805</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Get off your bike a car is coming , hmmmm so the same logic would say that if a cop is driving along in a cop car and an ambulance is wanting to pass him and there is no room the cop should drive over a cliff so the ambulance can instantly pass. And do not any one suggest  the cop should speed up and race ahead as we all know that todays cops are such crap drivers they crash or cause others to crash once  they get a couple of k&#039;s over the speed limit.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Get off your bike a car is coming , hmmmm so the same logic would say that if a cop is driving along in a cop car and an ambulance is wanting to pass him and there is no room the cop should drive over a cliff so the ambulance can instantly pass. And do not any one suggest  the cop should speed up and race ahead as we all know that todays cops are such crap drivers they crash or cause others to crash once  they get a couple of k&#8217;s over the speed limit.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Errol Brocklehurst		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1298</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Errol Brocklehurst]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jan 2017 05:10:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1298</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have been cycling for 42 years, and not once have I heard of cyclist been told to get off the road til now.
maybe the police should look at the drivers and tell them to be more respectful of other road users, I drove trucks as a job and saw enough to stop driving as car drivers cared little about their own safety or other others. Come on nz police pull your socks up and see the bigger picture.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been cycling for 42 years, and not once have I heard of cyclist been told to get off the road til now.<br />
maybe the police should look at the drivers and tell them to be more respectful of other road users, I drove trucks as a job and saw enough to stop driving as car drivers cared little about their own safety or other others. Come on nz police pull your socks up and see the bigger picture.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Criggie		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1297</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Criggie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2015 04:13:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1297</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Did the supposed &quot;asian tourist&quot; ever get located?  I wonder what their view was.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did the supposed &#8220;asian tourist&#8221; ever get located?  I wonder what their view was.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Velocipede		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1296</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Velocipede]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2015 11:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1296</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1295&quot;&gt;Cyclomaniac&lt;/a&gt;.

Separated cycle paths everywhere are not going to happen. As the the simplistic and very expensive solution they represent (as if cost especially when sans &quot;externalities&quot; should be the sole arbiter of everything) they are one linear, exclusive way to go, but are not necessary. Active transport - including cycling - is good, but exclusivity is but one way to encourage it, and not necessarily the most effective.

As I have said in a prior post, I am no especial fan of having separated cycleways &quot;everywhere&quot;, especially if cyclists are required to use them as if to get out of the way or otherwise render cyclists invisible to motorists whom too often act as if we are an inconvenience to be ignored at best. I fully recognise I speak first and foremost for myself???, and not necessarily for the cycling majority, nor for the many who claim they would cycle if only it were &quot;safer&quot;, something loosely defined but often equated with the provision of separated, dedicated cycleways.

Having said the above, I do like white lines on roads demarcating cyclist space on busy roads. Its a shame they are so often disrespected and used a convenient &quot;pull-over spot&quot;, dedicated &quot;car door opening zone&quot;, corner cutting &quot;short-cut&quot;, road work &quot;paraphernalia placement zone&quot;, etc. Still, they seem to mean something to motorists at least some of the time, even more so with the type cycle lane separators currently making an appearance in this fair city. But in my opinion they are no replacement for better educated, better behaved motorists (and cyclists!) who not only see cyclists, but respect us. Moreover, they are just not necessary on most road relatively little travelled.

Rather, I&#039;d love to see a 30kmph max speed on all residential streets as well as in anything approaching a CBD-type zone of intensified activity. Hell, I&#039;ll even settle in the first instance for a more even, equable and stringent recognition of the Road Code and its rule above all other rules of &quot;driving to the conditions&quot;, which includes recognising the presence of cyclists (and pedestrians).

I have not biked in Sri Lanka but have done so in India, as well as US and Europe. NZ is worst, by the way: indeed, despite the hype, we are not a cycle friendly tourist destination as I&#039;ve heard it from way too many foreign cycle-tourists and confirmed by my own comparative experience. US and European drivers were often &quot;overly&quot; respectful, oddly enough. In India, I never felt unsafe on a cycle even biking in the dark without lights (there was a method, if not an entirely convincing rationale), no cycle lanes necessary. Diesel fumes from poorly maintained Indian trucks are highly problematic for sure, but there is a way of using the road there which might take more time for some to get used to than others but which in my experience revolves around a mutual accommodation which works for all road users including motorists, cyclists, elephants, goats and chickens (even as its typical to see trucks poorly maintained regularly leave the highway in disastrous fashion). For the most part traffic travels slowly, but more than that there is a sense of flow without a cycle lane in sight which I don&#039;t think we&#039;ll ever be able to replicate here with our overriding &quot;race in front at all costs&quot;, &quot;go for the gap&quot;, &quot;merge like a sledgehammer&quot; mentality where the rules apply to everyone but me, eff anyone in my way.

Which all goes to say the the provision of so-called cycle-friendly infrastructure singularly dedicated is just one way of addressing the problem, the most expensive but not necessarily the most effective. From my perspective, I&#039;d far rather have a motor vehicle driver culture that recognises the inherent right of cyclists to exist and treats us (and pedestrians) accordingly. With the right directives and enforcement, I do believe it is possible. I&#039;m not going to hold my breath for the former because its too hard in a sacred car worshiping culture, so cycle lanes we are going to get, albeit begrudgingly.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1295">Cyclomaniac</a>.</p>
<p>Separated cycle paths everywhere are not going to happen. As the the simplistic and very expensive solution they represent (as if cost especially when sans &#8220;externalities&#8221; should be the sole arbiter of everything) they are one linear, exclusive way to go, but are not necessary. Active transport &#8211; including cycling &#8211; is good, but exclusivity is but one way to encourage it, and not necessarily the most effective.</p>
<p>As I have said in a prior post, I am no especial fan of having separated cycleways &#8220;everywhere&#8221;, especially if cyclists are required to use them as if to get out of the way or otherwise render cyclists invisible to motorists whom too often act as if we are an inconvenience to be ignored at best. I fully recognise I speak first and foremost for myself???, and not necessarily for the cycling majority, nor for the many who claim they would cycle if only it were &#8220;safer&#8221;, something loosely defined but often equated with the provision of separated, dedicated cycleways.</p>
<p>Having said the above, I do like white lines on roads demarcating cyclist space on busy roads. Its a shame they are so often disrespected and used a convenient &#8220;pull-over spot&#8221;, dedicated &#8220;car door opening zone&#8221;, corner cutting &#8220;short-cut&#8221;, road work &#8220;paraphernalia placement zone&#8221;, etc. Still, they seem to mean something to motorists at least some of the time, even more so with the type cycle lane separators currently making an appearance in this fair city. But in my opinion they are no replacement for better educated, better behaved motorists (and cyclists!) who not only see cyclists, but respect us. Moreover, they are just not necessary on most road relatively little travelled.</p>
<p>Rather, I&#8217;d love to see a 30kmph max speed on all residential streets as well as in anything approaching a CBD-type zone of intensified activity. Hell, I&#8217;ll even settle in the first instance for a more even, equable and stringent recognition of the Road Code and its rule above all other rules of &#8220;driving to the conditions&#8221;, which includes recognising the presence of cyclists (and pedestrians).</p>
<p>I have not biked in Sri Lanka but have done so in India, as well as US and Europe. NZ is worst, by the way: indeed, despite the hype, we are not a cycle friendly tourist destination as I&#8217;ve heard it from way too many foreign cycle-tourists and confirmed by my own comparative experience. US and European drivers were often &#8220;overly&#8221; respectful, oddly enough. In India, I never felt unsafe on a cycle even biking in the dark without lights (there was a method, if not an entirely convincing rationale), no cycle lanes necessary. Diesel fumes from poorly maintained Indian trucks are highly problematic for sure, but there is a way of using the road there which might take more time for some to get used to than others but which in my experience revolves around a mutual accommodation which works for all road users including motorists, cyclists, elephants, goats and chickens (even as its typical to see trucks poorly maintained regularly leave the highway in disastrous fashion). For the most part traffic travels slowly, but more than that there is a sense of flow without a cycle lane in sight which I don&#8217;t think we&#8217;ll ever be able to replicate here with our overriding &#8220;race in front at all costs&#8221;, &#8220;go for the gap&#8221;, &#8220;merge like a sledgehammer&#8221; mentality where the rules apply to everyone but me, eff anyone in my way.</p>
<p>Which all goes to say the the provision of so-called cycle-friendly infrastructure singularly dedicated is just one way of addressing the problem, the most expensive but not necessarily the most effective. From my perspective, I&#8217;d far rather have a motor vehicle driver culture that recognises the inherent right of cyclists to exist and treats us (and pedestrians) accordingly. With the right directives and enforcement, I do believe it is possible. I&#8217;m not going to hold my breath for the former because its too hard in a sacred car worshiping culture, so cycle lanes we are going to get, albeit begrudgingly.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Cyclomaniac		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1295</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cyclomaniac]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2015 07:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1295</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As much as I would like to see separated cycle paths everywhere, I know this is not going to happen. Even in the most cycle-friendly countries there are roads that need to be shared. I have cycled around Sri Lanka for four weeks and never felt unsafe on the road even though cycling infrastructure does not exist. Some roads simply need to be shared, and that does not mean that the person with the most horsepower should not have to share the road. This incident puts cyclists unnecessarily in a bad light but probably does more damage to the Police. They should have publicly apologised to Alex and explained that all road users have a right to use the road. This shows them as narrow minded small town cops driving around in their Holdens without actually realising they need to enforce safety for all road users and not just reducing travel times for impatient car drivers. Hop out of those Holdens, engage with the community and ask your boss for a bike...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As much as I would like to see separated cycle paths everywhere, I know this is not going to happen. Even in the most cycle-friendly countries there are roads that need to be shared. I have cycled around Sri Lanka for four weeks and never felt unsafe on the road even though cycling infrastructure does not exist. Some roads simply need to be shared, and that does not mean that the person with the most horsepower should not have to share the road. This incident puts cyclists unnecessarily in a bad light but probably does more damage to the Police. They should have publicly apologised to Alex and explained that all road users have a right to use the road. This shows them as narrow minded small town cops driving around in their Holdens without actually realising they need to enforce safety for all road users and not just reducing travel times for impatient car drivers. Hop out of those Holdens, engage with the community and ask your boss for a bike&#8230;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Criggie		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1294</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Criggie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2015 07:10:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1294</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288&quot;&gt;Roger Cleave&lt;/a&gt;.

No need to kiss arse, but no need to be an &quot;arrogant cyclist&quot; the ones who give us all a bad name.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288">Roger Cleave</a>.</p>
<p>No need to kiss arse, but no need to be an &#8220;arrogant cyclist&#8221; the ones who give us all a bad name.</p>
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		<title>
		By: shermo		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1293</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[shermo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2015 22:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1293</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288&quot;&gt;Roger Cleave&lt;/a&gt;.

Criggie - so we should cower and ask for forgiveness whenever we deal with police? Perhaps that&#039;s the reality of it, but I&#039;d rather my fate not be at the whim of someone who spent 6 months in police college.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288">Roger Cleave</a>.</p>
<p>Criggie &#8211; so we should cower and ask for forgiveness whenever we deal with police? Perhaps that&#8217;s the reality of it, but I&#8217;d rather my fate not be at the whim of someone who spent 6 months in police college.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Criggie		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1292</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Criggie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2015 21:12:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1292</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288&quot;&gt;Roger Cleave&lt;/a&gt;.

I remember being pulled over by a cop for speeding once, years ago.  However I wasn&#039;t mouthy or full of attitude.  In fact I was honestly surprised at the speed the car had been going.

Cops have a &lt;em&gt;huge&lt;/em&gt; leeway in how they apply the law, and politeness and respect goes a long way.

I&#039;m supposing that Mister Caldwell &lt;em&gt;may&lt;/em&gt; have come across the wrong way, resulting in a more punitive response from the officer than was strictly required.

TL;DR?  A little politeness goes a long way.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1288">Roger Cleave</a>.</p>
<p>I remember being pulled over by a cop for speeding once, years ago.  However I wasn&#8217;t mouthy or full of attitude.  In fact I was honestly surprised at the speed the car had been going.</p>
<p>Cops have a <em>huge</em> leeway in how they apply the law, and politeness and respect goes a long way.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m supposing that Mister Caldwell <em>may</em> have come across the wrong way, resulting in a more punitive response from the officer than was strictly required.</p>
<p>TL;DR?  A little politeness goes a long way.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Velocipede		</title>
		<link>https://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/2015/06/19/police-suggest-cyclists-get-off-the-road/#comment-1291</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Velocipede]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2015 11:12:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cyclingchristchurch.co.nz/?p=7270#comment-1291</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Good on ya. May the mud not be in your eye!

Alas, recorded visual evidence does not overcome pre-conceived bias when it comes to law enforcement - or anything else for that matter if I am to get all philosophical.

I cannot but think that a (proposed) journey such as yours - either up or down or in part but including Dyers Pass Rd. - will be all the more common once the lift chairs and the like are constructed for the forthcoming bike-park on &quot;them thar hills.&quot; Dyers Pass Rd. only promises to get a whole lot more interesting, even as it regularly hosts many of Christchurch&#039;s most respectful drivers IMHO.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good on ya. May the mud not be in your eye!</p>
<p>Alas, recorded visual evidence does not overcome pre-conceived bias when it comes to law enforcement &#8211; or anything else for that matter if I am to get all philosophical.</p>
<p>I cannot but think that a (proposed) journey such as yours &#8211; either up or down or in part but including Dyers Pass Rd. &#8211; will be all the more common once the lift chairs and the like are constructed for the forthcoming bike-park on &#8220;them thar hills.&#8221; Dyers Pass Rd. only promises to get a whole lot more interesting, even as it regularly hosts many of Christchurch&#8217;s most respectful drivers IMHO.</p>
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